In the account of Josiah the king of Judah the Lord said he would remove Judah from his presence despite Josiah doing all the good move. What does this mean?
The statement that the Lord would "remove His presence from Judah" despite all the good deeds of King Josiah reflects a profound theological and historical moment found primarily in 2 Kings 22–23 and 2 Chronicles 34–35.
1. The Context
King Josiah, who reigned in Judah around 640–609 BC, was one of the most righteous kings in Judah's history. He sought the Lord, instituted widespread religious reforms, tore down idolatrous altars, and restored proper worship (2 Kings 23:1–25).
Yet, 2 Kings 23:26–27 says:
"Nevertheless, the Lord did not turn from the heat of His fierce anger, which burned against Judah because of all that Manasseh had done to provoke Him to anger. So the Lord said, 'I will remove Judah also from my presence as I removed Israel...'" (NIV)
2. What This Means
Despite Josiah’s reforms, God's decision to bring judgment on Judah remained unchanged. Here’s why:
a. Deep-Rooted Sin of Judah
Josiah’s grandfather, Manasseh, had introduced extreme idolatry, even sacrificing children (2 Kings 21:6). This led Judah into generational corruption, which had taken deep root in the nation’s heart.
b. The People’s Superficial Response
Josiah was sincere, but the people’s repentance appears shallow or temporary. After Josiah’s death, they quickly returned to evil ways (2 Chronicles 36:15–16; Jeremiah 3:10), proving their reform was not heartfelt.
c. God’s Justice and Covenant Warning
God had warned, even from Moses' time (Deuteronomy 28–30), that persistent rebellion would result in exile and loss of the land. Judah had crossed a point of no return.
3. Yet Mercy to Josiah
Despite this national judgment, God said Josiah would not see the disaster in his lifetime (2 Kings 22:20). He would die in peace, meaning he wouldn’t witness the Babylonian conquest.
4. Theological Takeaway
This reveals a dual message:
- Individual righteousness matters — Josiah is honored and spared.
- But collective sin has consequences — Judah as a nation had become unfaithful for too long.
It underscores both God’s justice and His mercy, His long patience and eventual judgment when repentance is not genuine or lasting.
Removing Judah or Israel from his presence sounds a big deal like losing one's salvation suffering in eternal hell. YET WHAT did Paul mean when he said all Israel will be saved?
Your question goes to the heart of one of the most profound tensions in the Bible: God's judgment versus His promise of salvation.
1. “I will remove Judah/Israel from my presence” (2 Kings 23:27)
This means God would withdraw His covenantal protection and presence from His people—no longer dwelling among them in the temple or defending them as He had in the past. The result: conquest, exile, and national collapse.
But this does not necessarily mean every individual Israelite lost salvation or went to eternal punishment. It was a national judgment, not a final pronouncement on eternal destiny.
2. “All Israel will be saved” – Romans 11:26
Paul writes:
> “And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written: ‘The Deliverer will come from Zion; He will remove ungodliness from Jacob.’” (Romans 11:26, ESV)
a. What Paul means by “all Israel”
There are three main interpretations:
Ethnic Israel: Many believe Paul refers to a future large-scale turning of ethnic Jews to Christ, perhaps at the end of history (cf. Zechariah 12:10).
Spiritual Israel: Others argue Paul means the totality of God’s people, Jews and Gentiles alike, who trust in Christ.
A faithful remnant throughout history: Some see “all Israel” as the remnant chosen by grace (Romans 11:5), cumulatively saved over time.
b. The Key Message
Paul’s main point in Romans 9–11 is this:
Although many Jews rejected Christ, God has not rejected His people (Romans 11:1).
Their hardening is temporary and serves a purpose: the gospel goes to the Gentiles, which will eventually lead to Israel’s restoration.
God’s gifts and calling are irrevocable (Romans 11:29).
3. How These Fit Together
The removal from God's presence in Kings was temporal and disciplinary.
The promise of salvation in Romans is eternal and redemptive.
Israel was judged, but not forgotten.
Even in exile, God preserved a remnant, and in Christ, He brings about the fulfillment of the promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
4. A Glimpse of the Gospel
This arc—from judgment to redemption—is the same pattern seen in the whole biblical story:
> God disciplines those He loves, but His mercy triumphs over judgment (James 2:13).
Would you like a breakdown of how Old Testament prophecy (e.g., Ezekiel, Isaiah) relates to Paul’s claim in Romans 11?
Please.
Excellent. To understand Paul’s statement in Romans 11:26 (“all Israel will be saved”) in light of the Old Testament prophets, let’s explore how Isaiah, Ezekiel, Jeremiah, and others laid the theological groundwork for this hope of national redemption—even after judgment.
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1. Isaiah: A Faithful Remnant and Future Restoration
a. Judgment First
Isaiah 10:22: “Though your people be like the sand by the sea, only a remnant will return.”
Meaning: Israel will be judged, but a faithful remnant will survive. This theme echoes in Paul’s argument (Romans 9:27).
b. Then Salvation
Isaiah 59:20–21: “The Redeemer will come to Zion... to those in Jacob who repent of their sins.”
This is the very verse Paul quotes in Romans 11:26.
It foretells a future spiritual awakening in Israel connected to the coming of the Redeemer (Messiah).
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2. Ezekiel: New Heart and Spirit for Israel
a. Exile is Judgment for Idolatry
Ezekiel 36:17–21: God scattered Israel among the nations due to defilement and idolatry.
b. Restoration Is for God’s Name
Ezekiel 36:22–28: “I will take you from the nations... I will sprinkle clean water on you... I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you.”
Implication: Salvation will come not by merit but by God’s grace, for the sake of His name.
c. Vision of Resurrection
Ezekiel 37 (Valley of Dry Bones): God breathes life into dry bones (dead Israel), a prophecy of national and spiritual revival.
Paul would see this as typologically fulfilled in Christ’s resurrection and the future resurrection of Israel's faith.
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3. Jeremiah: The New Covenant
a. Old Covenant Broken
Jeremiah 31:31–32: Israel broke the Mosaic covenant; judgment followed (exile).
b. Promise of a New Covenant
Jeremiah 31:33–34: “I will put my law within them... they will all know Me... for I will forgive their iniquity.”
This New Covenant is the very one Jesus inaugurated (Luke 22:20).
Paul teaches that this covenant is extended first to the Jews, then to the Gentiles, yet its fulfillment to “all Israel” is still unfolding.
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4. Paul’s Logic in Romans 11 (Summarized)
Israel’s rejection of Christ is not final (Rom 11:11).
Gentiles’ salvation is meant to provoke Israel to jealousy (v.14).
God will graft them back in if they do not persist in unbelief (v.23).
Then: “all Israel will be saved”—fulfilling Isaiah 59, Jeremiah 31, and Ezekiel 36–37.
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5. Theological Synthesis
Prophetic Promise Fulfilled or Ongoing in Christ? Seen in Romans 11
New heart (Ezek 36) Yes, in the Spirit Applied to Israel’s future
Return from exile (Isa 11, Jer 30) Partial (post-586 BC), future spiritual return remains Implied restoration
Remnant saved (Isa 10, Mic 2) Ongoing through history “Remnant chosen by grace” (Rom 11:5)
All Israel saved (Isa 59, Jer 31) Not yet fully realized Awaiting future fulfillment
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Would you like a visual chart or a timeline connecting these Old Testament prophecies to Paul’s teaching in Romans 11?
Here is a visual timeline showing the connection between key Old Testament prophetic promises and Paul’s teaching in Romans 11. It spans from Isaiah’s prophecy around 730 BC to Paul’s letter to the Romans around AD 57, illustrating how themes like the remnant, the New Covenant, and spiritual restoration culminate in Paul’s statement that “all Israel will be saved.”
Would you like this chart in a printable format (e.g., PDF) or with explanatory notes for each entry?
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